Tuesday, August 4, 2009

The Defended Medium POS Experiment

OK, based on recent experiences with Small POS's in Class 2 and especially Class 3 WH Systems, I feel like my fat wallet can afford some experimentation into the "Defended Medium POS" setup.

NOTE: This post edited based on some great commentary by Quivering Palm and be sure to check out his upcoming "POS Fittings" show - Thanks again for the sage advice Quiv!

Now first off, I am certainly no POS Warfare expert, but a few hours of research, a few POS guides and some comments, I decided on a solution that balances firepower with sheer frustration:
  • 1x Minmatar Control Tower Medium (Artillery bonuses)
  • 1x Ship Maintenance Array
  • 1x Corporate Hangar Array
  • 1x Medium Intensive Refining Array***
  • 2x EW - Stasis Webification Battery
  • 2x EW - Warp Disruption Battery
  • 8x EW - ECM (2 of each type)
  • 4x Medium Artillery Battery
  • 6x Small Artillery Battery
  • Plus 10 Days of POS Fuel.
Total Bill including Fuel: Just under 350M ISK, with each additional week of POS Fuel running about 30M ISK.

Here is the IGB POS Tool Link

WAIT, you say! You cannot online all of these! A Medium POS cannot take the load! Well, some clever folks over at the Planet Risk Show had some good angles on managing onlining/offlining the modules to apply the best force when needed. So a couple of pieces to get straight. First off, I will only be onlining the intensive array when I am ready to batch refine. This alone allows me to keep everythng else except one small turret online, and dramatically reduces (Heavy Water) fuel consumption. When I am batch refining, I can take selected turrets or other components offline (ex: 2 Medium Turrets and 1 Small Turret). Once refining is completed, I can online them again. Per Quiv's comment below, I can also choose to keep the guns offline until I get attacked, but I might start with keeping them onlined - I kind of like the deterrent to even firing a single salvo when I am AFK.

*** Oh Yes, a Refining Array - I am finally skilled up on Gas Harvesting Skill Level 5 and Mining and Refining Skills all to Level 4 or better. Based on feedback, you should really only consider the Medium Intensive Refinery for the higher refining yield. Combined with skilling up your ore-specific refining skills, you can make the most of your rock (and gas) grinding.

The idea being to make it as frustrating and risky as possible - (a) ECM Jammers to eliminate AFK attackers and then (b) Make it painful for small gangs via Statis Webbers and Small Artillery for turret tracking fast frigates, Warp Disruptors to minimize warp-outs for repair, and Medium Batteries for larger ships.

Certainly a long way from indestructible, but with proper exit management in Class 2 systems, I find it hard to believe I will see much action on my POS. The only real issue remains if another POS goes up in the system with lots of pilots.

Placements - The idea is to place in balanced locations by type, but spread by types such that there is no single grouping of multiple systems. You are looking for the "Max Spines" look, as it looks more menacing IMHO.

Feedback or Comments appreciated...


  1. Hey Star Defender,

    Minmatar medium is solid! We went for that on our first POS in wspace as well.

    I wouldn't go for anything else but the Intensive Refinery Array. The plain one gives you a cap of 25% of the ore you mine - meaning you loose 75% of tha precious arkonor. I'd rather not. The Medium Intensive is better, yet not as good as stations but unless you have a frequent / daily access to high sec to go and refine I'd go for the Medium Intensive one. You can just keep it offline if you don' use it and thus minimize fuel consumption.

    Sensor dampeners are no good - rather put some more guns - you don't have enough or webifinders. I'd go for 4-5 Medium Art 6 Small Art and some Autocannons - and keep them offline. If you get attacked you put everything inside the pos offline and put all the guns online. Make sure you get the skills to control them too cause it should help.

    We will make sure to talk a bit about POS setup and "POS fittings" in our next show, Wednesday 20:00 eve time on The Planet Risk Show on Split Infinity Radio. Check it out at http://theplanetriskshow.com

  2. Thanks Quiv - duly noted on the intensive array - even with all of my refining skills to 4 that is a huge refining yield difference. I had not considered offlining it when not processing - thanks for that.

    On the dampeners - thanks - I was just trying to fill out some available MW - good to know they should be swapped out - Interesting angle on managing what is online/offline to maximize the DPS with additional firepower - Interesting that is not mentioned in all of my readings of posts and guides. Makes sense. I think I will shoot for maintaining as many online turrets as possible while the refinery is offline and then toggle between refinery and the additional firepower.

    I am going to update my post with these approaches - I appreciate the feedback and will link to your show in the main post.

  3. I saw your listing for what you brought into Class 2s (POS, ships, loadouts) but was wondering what you brought into Class 3s. I am curious how well you do in them solo/alt wise?

  4. I brought the same setup into Class 3's.

    There were only two differences - (1) the occasional site where I had to take down dual Sleepless BS (just meant more repper management between my main and alt) and (2) higher hostile visitor traffic.

    The former was not an issue, most of the Frontier sites are still Solo-Alt capable, with an occasional warp-out to repair as a minor change from Class 2. One side note - in the few Class 3's I did the salvage/ISK yield seemed lower than Class 2's, thus my initial consideration to return to Class 2's.

    The latter (hostiles) was really the driving force to move back to Class 2 - the increased mass limitation for Class 3 means larger roaming packs of pirates...

    I think I am likely going to net-out with Class 2 as the ideal level for Solo+Alt WH farming.

  5. hi.

    just wanting to say you thanks for you notes. Based on you experience we are now (me and a friend) in a class 2 WH with a setup similar to your small Caldari POS. We only added 5 missile batteries that will (at least in theory) provide extra risk for anyone willing to attack.

  6. Thanks Alex - let us know how it works out. Convo me sometime - I am trying to maintain a list of small corps that are out there in WH-space. Maybe in the future we will form up a larger corp or an alliance.

  7. Great to see you back Star, I have missed your posts.
    I am pretty close to my first venture into W-Space, but have chosen to go with a large control tower and two alts.
    Just need to get some real life work issues out of the way, and then I will be following in your footsteps. :)

  8. Thanks Dirk - I can relate on the RL front.

    Big jump on Fuel with large POS - Let me know how it goes.

  9. so, regarding POS Fittings, we managed to talk about that on our latest show, you should check it out http://www.planetriskshow.com/episode-3/ and give us feedback!


  10. Star,
    Thats a great mini-tutorial on how to set up a Med POS. Our corp is looking at doing that in high sec, and I was wondering what your thoughts are in using a Med Domination tower as opposed to a Med Minmatar tower. Is there an advantage to one over the other?

  11. Thanks Anon - The only difference between the standard Minmatar -vs- Domination is +4.5M Shield HitPoints and slightly faster anchoring and onlining. Totally up to you whether or not the premium price is worth that extra shield.

    However, my personal opinion on Medium Towers in general is that although you can mount a defense against griefers and small gangs, any corp looking to displace you will do so on any medium POS, so the extra HP's are likely not really worth it.

  12. Star,
    I hope that you are still reading this site. My question for you is what did you use to bring in all that equipment?
    A corp mate and I are looking at dragging in a couple of other corp mates, and all that stuff, into a wh. My fear is that with a class 2, it will close after my orca brings in the tower (and assorted goodies).

  13. Anon - definitely still active! Keep reading through to current posts - you will see the strategies and findings continue to evolve. I now have a permant W-space C2 system witha static C2 exit. I maintain a large POS and farm the local and adjoining systems and supplement income with Hybrid Reactions and just getting into T3 manufacturing.

    In terms of the POS deployment, I now have twin Iteron V's max-fitted for transport, which means each can fit just over 55,000 m3 with GSC's. A couple of round trips from a local staging system gets me there pretty quickly. Then, I bring in the support ships.

    Here are somee relevant posts:



    In terms of the Orca, with a mass of 250M kg, you have plenty of mass in even the smallest WH (smallest C2 I have ever seen is 750M kg). Keep in mind that anything stored in your Cargo Bay, Corp Hangar and Ship Maintenance Bay do NOT count as extra mass, so load as much as you can into that Orca, including ships. Assuming you are probing with a frigate, even after you bookmark your moon and return with the Orca, after the Orca is in, you still have at least another 300M+ kg of mass remaining.

    Just be sure to carefully evaluate and monitor the WH information.